“How are you”,”Welcome to Toronto”, “Have a nice day”
Ever use these phrases? Better make sure nobody out there owns the trademark on them; you could get a bill in the mail one day.
That’s what happened in the small town of Parry Sound, Ontario when a local non-profit Snowmobile group used the slogan “Welcome to Parry Sound Snowmobile District” on their website. Nick Slater, an internet provider had previously trademarked the use of the phrase with the Canadian Intellectual Property Office for online use because he was concerned that the keywords would be used by others and cause his Google ranking to drop.
He began invoicing the town and the snowmobilers for the repeated use, but the bills were simply ignored.
He has since filed a small claims lawsuit for copyright infringement.
The town of Parry Sound has rallied together to fight Mr. Slater and the media here in Toronto has rallied along. News articles in the Toronto Sun, The National Post, and Toronto radio station am640 have helped bring this subject to a more public arena.
My question is, “can anyone own the rights to a word or a phrase?”
A few years ago I had heard stories of Donald Trump trade marking the term “You’re Fired” from the show ” The Apprentice”. Paris Hilton trademarked the term “That’s Hot” as they were probably the only two words she could actually spell.
If these words have been around for centuries, can anyone actually have ownership to them?
The word “Google” can be argued was never a word that existed prior to the company’s inception, I’m sure there are other such examples, but “Welcome to Parry Sound”, I think that may have been utter out loud prior to Mr. Slater’s trademark filing.
Just because someone from the government is willing to take your money when you trademark something, probably doesn’t necessarily mean that you have total rights to it.
How far into the court system this will go is a mystery, but it would send a dangerous precedent if simple terms such as “Welcome to Parry Sound” become banned from use by everyone except for the person who owns the trademark.
“Have a great weekend”…shoot! I smell a lawsuit coming.
Hey… This guy nick has even got Face book scared.. they closed the site and made us rename it…I wonder if Welcome to face book is trade marked..
You ask, “Can anyone own the rights to a word or a phrase?”. The simple answer is yes, that is what copyright and trademarks are all about. In our case, we trademarked “Welcome to Parry Sound” for online use to protect our website of the same name. We have not “banned” the use of “Welcome to Parry Sound”. We love Parry Sound and want everyone to say “Welcome to Parry Sound” and celebrate Parry Sound. Therefore, we do not restrict speech or signs or other printed material unless it is related to our website. The Facebook protest group was removed by Facebook on the merits because the group was attempting to defend lawbreakers by breaking the law themselves. Ignorance can be very dangerous. More dangerous is Toronto Media capitalizing on the story for ratings, not from any sense of right or wrong. The right thing to do is to read and understand the background information before perpetuating a fallacy. What ever happened to fact-checking? Please try to be more responsible!
P.S. Google was a word before it was a website. It means one followed by a hundred zeroes – sounds like a banned Facebook Administrator!
‘Fact Checking’ is exactly what this is about. Fact; Only once has a ‘Welcome to (place name)’ ever been trade marked in Canada legally. Welcome to New Brunswick was trade marked by Her Majesty the Queen. The last time I checked, Nick Slater wasn’t royalty. There is a reason that Welcome to Toronto, Welcome to Barrie and other town and city names in Canada are not trade marked and there are hundreds of websites that use those phrases and greetings, and that is because according to the Canadian Trade Mark Guidelines the names of geographic locations cannot be trade marked. Also, trade marks are supposed to be unique and distinctive to the product or service. Welcome to Parry Sound is neither unique nor distinctive, nor is it very original. Welcome to the facts.
It comes down to this Nick, you are simply an indecent greed-monger who attacks not-for-profit local organizations, it’s simply misdirected legal profiteering. You are an absolute fool, and I can only assume that this will be the demise of not only your business (Zeuter) but also your reputation. Mind you, this statement is not to imply that you had a good reputation in the first place. You have been recognized by many as an absolute fool long before this fiasco, and now you are simply proving the credibility of such allegations. You should realize that the level of indecency you have demonstrated is inexcusable, and will only serve to negatively affect you in current/future endeavours. You have dug your own metaphorical grave Nick Slater, and the town of Parry Sound looks forward to seeing you in it.
How exactly is Welcome to Parry Sound Snowmobile club related to your website? Their site is not called ‘welcome to parry sound’. In fact it seems to have very little to do with the town and more to do with a freakin snowmobile club! The only people who might get it confused for your site, is you, you moron!
Speaking of fact checking, Nick. Perhaps you would like to look up the definition of the word ‘Googol’. I believe you will find that it is in fact a cardinal number with the value of 1 followed by one hundred zeroes. When the domain name was originally registered for Google, Larry Page and Sergey Brin accidentally misspelled the word googol. This resulted in the creation of a unique word which up until that point in time did not exist.
It becomes difficult to criticize an individual’s ability to check facts when it is clear that you do not yourself.
“We love Parry Sound and want everyone to say “Welcome to Parry Sound” ”
It’s all so clear now! We can all say it, it’s just that nobody is allowed to print it.
“Therefore, we do not restrict speech or signs or other printed material unless it is related to our website.”
Please explain how the phrase “Welcome to Parry Sound” can in any way be related to your website when used on any other site or sign? Surely even you can admit that the phrase is not synonymous with Zeuter. Go ahead, trademark welcometoparrysound.com, that’s your site. But to expect every Parry Sound related website, sign and promotional material to refrain from using the phrase “Welcome to Parry Sound” (unless it’s a direct link or reference to your website of course) is ludicrous. None of the organizations from which you are seeking compensation were making any sort of reference to your site by the use of “Welcome to Parry Sound” and no one (besides you) ever thought they were.
So Nick Slater, then why are you contemplating suing the Town of Parry Sound if you love it so much and you want everyone to use the phrase?
You’re an egomaniac and you do not own this town! Your permission is not needed or wanted! Every time you open your mouth you look even more the fool, save your breath, you can’t defend what you’re doing.
The Parry Sound Snowmobile District’s web site has nothing to do with Nick’s sad attempt at marketing and poor excuse of a website. welcometoparrysound.com makes Parry Sound look like we are stuck in the early days of html. If Nick actually liked Parry Sound he would take a web design course and bring his web site up to date. He brags about hits but does not understand bounce rate. I feel sorry for anyone that has actually bought advertising from him and I have talked to a few people that feel sorry that they actually bought advertising from him.
I know that he has accused one local manager of lying about advertising money because they did not want to advertise with him because they saw zero results. He got mad at the manager, and demanded the head office’s number. The head office told him to quit harassing their store manager.
Welcome to Parry Sound everyone!
“The Facebook protest group was removed by Facebook on the merits because the group was attempting to defend lawbreakers by breaking the law themselves.”
There is no proof yet that anyone has broken any laws any more than you have, Mr Slater. That is your claim, and your charges, but we live in a free country and it will take someone with much more importance than you to decide ( and perhaps look into how you managed to acquire these ‘trade marks’ in the first place ). As far as lawbreakers, there are many more types of laws that what is in the books, like the laws of decency, courtesy and pride. Who’s the ‘lawbreaker’ now?
What is embarassing to Parry Sound are people who cannot read and understand plain English. We do not restrict speech, including email, or signs. Put up all the signs you want, scream “Welcome to Parry Sound” out to everyone you meet. I give you permission if you think you need it.
The trademark is not the issue. We already have the trademark. “Welcome to Parry Sound” is just as valid as “Welcome to New Brunswick”, what makes you think it isn’t? If you have a problem with that, talk to the Federal Government. It is the unlawful use of our trademark by PSSD and others which is the issue. Our society does not permit one to simply assume the property of another without penalty for malicious or well-meaning or any other reason. You can do it, but you will pay the price.
I love Parry Sound, the Town, The District, the Body of Water. Over more than 50 years I have explored and revered the natural beauty and tranquility. Unfortunately, I do not love the Corporation of the Town of Parry Sound, but I would like to. I think they need some real changes, particularly one or two individuals. I have no problem with Council, but they feel they cannot hire and fire. I hope the actions of these Corporation of the Town of Parry Sound individuals in this matter will be reviewed once we have cleared this unfortunate PSSD hurdle. I urge local citizens to get more involved with their local government.
Zeuter was the first internet provider in Parry Sound. Founded in 1993 by me, Zeuter is one of the first ISPs in Canada, long before Sympatico, Rogers, Cogeco. As such we have a history with most of the people in Parry Sound. Over time, as in any business, competitors have sprung up, deadbeats have been garnished, misunderstandings have occurred. Still our business is thriving in a highly competitive field surrounded by giants. That’s because we not only do things right, but we do the right things.
From analyzing the Facebook comments, it is interesting to note that membership does not connote agreement only that they are following the thread. Only about 10% of members actually comment. And the vast majority of comments are expressed by a handful of people which are well known to us. Untrue and defamatory comments expressed on Facebook and here, for example, are not above the law and will be dealt with in time. Please do keep in mind when you post on the internet that you are not anonymous and you are responsible for what you say and how you treat others. Karma works both ways. Just think… is this really how you want your children to handle problems they encounter in future – by civil disobedience? When all you need is the word “the”?
I am sure some will enjoy their 15 minutes of fame. And I am also sure that people who do bad things are not necessarily bad people. Just confused, misdirected, frustrated, sometimes pathetic creatures with too much time on their hands. Try creating instead of destroying – it feels great!:)
P.S. Let’s not forget that HST begins July 1st. Isn’t that really what we should be focussing on right now? There is a topic that really deserves national attention and action. Wars used to be fought over a 10% tithe. Now we are supposed to pay 8% more for our internet for what? Will it work faster, will there be less spam? What are we getting for our 8%? Let’s get real, people!
You’re talking about karma, Nick? You have no idea of the concept. You love Parry Sound? Bah ! Attacking the non-profit Parry Sound Snowmobile District organization is an attack on this town. Many depend on the local snowmobile association to keep the snowmobile industry alive in this area. ‘Welcome to Parry Sound Snowmobile District’ has as little impact or concern to you and your business that oh, let’s say, a website that says Welcome to Parry Sound District Court House.
Get real!
PS; the signs are merely symbolic to show support. Nobody thinks they need your permission.
I am at a loss in understanding how Mr. So’n'So can copyright a simple greeting? A welcome that has been in use long before he was even a thougtht?
I am not origionally from Parry Sound.. But I stand proud in saying this is where I live..
You Mr. So’n'So will NOT tell me what I can and cannot choose to say..
I have raised my children to be proud Parry Sounders..
I tell them that they are AMBASSADORS for the TOWN OF PARRY SOUND.
THAT IT IS THEIR DUTY AS IT IS.. OF ALL PARRY SOUNDERS to proudly represent and show the best that this town has to offer!
What have you done for this Town Mr. So’n'So?
Your greed is baffling..
If truly you feel the need to copyright —>GREETINGS
Get a job with HALLMARK!
I find it very interesting that Nick avoided acknowledging nearly every response made in between his two comments.
His downfall will be his morbidly obese ego and lack of reading skills.
The embarrassment to Parry Sound is the individual who has made national news and headlines for his outlandish lawsuit. Even Kevin Frankish on Breakfast Television implored you to ‘drop it’.
You are not only an embarrassment to Parry Sound but a national laughing stock as well.
PS, get Spell Check, you spelled ‘embarrassing’ wrong.
How embarrassing.
““Welcome to Parry Sound” is just as valid as “Welcome to New Brunswick”, what makes you think it isn’t? ”
LOL, wow, that’s the most arrogant thing I’ve read yet. Welcome to New Brunswick was granted to Her Majesty the Queen symbolically and ceremonially. The Canadian Trade Mark Guidelines were circumvented to accommodate this. How you got the TM for Welcome to Parry Sound is still questionable and the topic of much speculation on a national basis.
Nick
What goes around, comes around.
The percentage of people you speak about do not need to make any comments. We support the group, and that alone should tell you what we all think about your actions.
I have been coming to Parry Sound for various events and activities for nearly 8 years. I have brought along many friends to enjoy the friendly residents, businesses and beauty of the area. We have also donated to the local food bank, the SPCA, the Wildlife group as a token of our appreciation and to give back to the town of Parry Sound.
I find this attempt at extorting money from the town and the snowmobile organization downright despicable. The validity of ‘ownership’ and the method it has been obtained of the phrase ‘Welcome to Parry Sound’ by Mr. Slater needs to be addressed. It would appear Mr. Slater is attempting to bully the town and snowmobile group into submission. His rather childish redirection to the HST indicates, to me at least, he realizes he cannot overcome the increasing tide of public opinion, reason and community.
Mr. Slater, keep on topic!
If Nick states the simple addition of the word “the” into the phrase would change it, why would the addition of “Parry Sound Snowmobile District” at the end be any different? They are not saying Welcome to Parry Sound “period”. They are saying Welcome to Parry Sound Snowmobile District and there is no doubt, that, they are definatly talking about the geographical region/area. Nick takes great pride in stating he brought the internet to Parry Sound, like he did somthing special. He did not invent the internet, he did not perform some great service for anyone. He opened a business that is it and he was paid for that service. You don’t hear Electricians bragging that they brought electricity to this house. They are only providing a service, which is all Nick has ever done. If he had not, someone else would of and when others did, many left Nick for better service.
It is quite fascinating that Mr. Slater has declined comment on Television, but pursues a thread here.
I believe Mr. Slater that the majority of individuals can read. I also am of the mind that just because an individual does not comment, does not mean they do not firmly believe in the cause. Perhaps you are foolish enough to believe that these open expressions of defiance in signage or verbage are not symptomatic of the root cause.
I find no embarrassment in the mass “civil disobedience”. And as a parent it is my obligation to provide the knowledge to my children when the right time for this “civil disobedience” should be appropriate. I am firm in my though this is such an occasion. You of all individuals have no right to
begin to lecture anyone on how to raise our children…are you a parent? I hope the bullying tactics you exhibit is not one you would continue as a parental practice. I would rather my children would emulate those individuals willing to sacrifice for the right, than to try to bully through the court system. And we all know that the courts are about who has the highest paid lawyer, not justice!
I also gather from your statement above that indeed you are vengeful little man. You thinly veil the threat to go after all who have “wronged you”.
Koodoos that you had “brought internet to Parry Sound”. Big deal. It was a business venture. Many of us have had business dealings with you. You even then are bullying, threatening and have poor customer service skills. (personal experience here) And there was NO misunderstanding!
I am thrilled you love Parry Sound. It is interesting that you take issue with those civil servants that are not bending to your threats and bullying tactics. Hmmm. Slater for mayor?
Really Nick, you avoid the issues, try to bully. and all you need to do is add the word “stop”.
kk, first off… you cant trademark a geographical location name, Nick, what your doing is against the law to begin with… look into it further, u say talk to the federal government about it, well… did the federal government allow u to TM “Welcome to Parry Sound” just the same as “Welcome to New Brunswick” like really??? youve got to take your own advice once in a while… i think you should just back down… everything you say is against something else youve said or done, who gave you the permision to TM words “Welcome to” from the english language and the Geographical location name “Parry Sound” who ever it is, if anyone , im sure has no athority or ownership over these words, i think your completly wrong about the whole thing… your acting as if you know how the world works but really it seems like your looking for attention from the press, your fighting a battle with no success, BRING IT TO COURT… LOOSE!!! GET IT OVER WITH…
He can’t comment on television. If he does, then the people in Parry Sound who don’t yet know his face will know what he looks like and he’ll never be able to leave his home.
People are boycotting Zeuter and any companies who choose to advertise with them. Is all this really worth becoming the most hated man in town?
Better watch out… some one will trademark “Nick Slater” and you’ll have to pay for the use of your own name.
I TM “Nick Slater”, im learning from him, so im TMing “Nick Slater”, i own it cuz i said so! lmao (jokes, he might sue me if i dont say this, im not really TMing it lol)
Bye Bye Sueter. Dont worry at least when your business goes busto, you can sit in front of the wall downtown begging for money with a sign that says Welcome to Parry Sound( I will send you $1000 for typing that). If I were you I would start filling out your application for Mcdonalds now, cause thats about the only work your going to get in Parry Sound after this.
I agree with Bea. Mr. Slater won’t show his face to the media because then people will know his face and refuse him services. I know I would.
Mr. Slater is very concerned about his Google(TM) traffic. Perhaps everyone should type in his so called trade mark words and visit any site that is not associated with Mr. Slater’s company.
It’s called consumer freedom. Move him down the list and off the first page!
“Welome To Parry Sound is just as valid as Welcome To New Brunswick”.
It is not the same, one is a specific distinct Logo that does not restrict the phrase or others in using the phrase in any way. It just restricts use of the specific Logo on merchandise/print etc. The other is a merely discriptive phrase that seems to be a waste of money to trademark in the first place. I mean, CIPO will take your money if you give it to them. I can’t imagine any reputable Trademark or Patent attorney would have even suggested it. Even Donald Trump trademarked, Your Fired, total waste of money. Despite all that suing ones own customers is a sucessful business model where?
Wow. Zeuter/ Nick – your website sucks. What a scam but its seems like the more you “publish” and say, the more you are trying to convince yourself of your stupidness. Such a petty, petty, fool.
You are really pathethic. Why would you do this… let alone, why would you do this in your own community? Are you even from Parry Sound? What a shame to your family, their kids, and the community you call “home”.
Wow. You are the one that should be sued, for creating such a waste and disturbing the peace.
It’s all about his Web site hits…he wants more hits, more Internet fame, more money…pathetic. Welcome To —– (insert any town name here) is a sentence… McDonald’s doesn’t sue people when they say, “I’m lovin’ it…” (“How’s the water in the pool, honey?” “I’m lovin’ it!”) Stop nitpicking at human conversation. We use phrases, words, sentences in a variety of ways…get over it.
Nick/Zeuter, when was the last time you actually updated your website, it looks like the web in 1996!
What your doing makes the town look bad, it’s an embarrassment, not to mention childish and pathetic.
I think this is an attempt for you to stay in business, you need money right? because your web site, like I said looks like its failing, and I don’t know 1 person who uses Zeuter! what is it like dial-up internet!!
I don’t know you, don’t want to know you, but I have a feeling I’ll be seeing alot of you shortly at Walmart when you greet me at the door.
Grow-up!!
Welcome to Parry Sound! As soon as the Slater circus hits federal court it will be the end. We can only hope all that were harassed by this poor excuse of a man will band together for a lawsuit to recover any money spent on the defense.We as Canadians must stand up against anyone who attempts to pull this crap. I call for a boycott of Zeuter Developement and of all businesses who continue to support him in his business.Hit him where it will hurt the most…his wallet and his ego.
Epic site I’m so glad I stumbled here through my friend’s blog, Going to need to add this one to the blogroll.
Bring your signs & t shirts to the court house July 20th…best behavior required please.
Ive known people who worked for that guy many times over the years. Total duche. He wont win in the end because of the obvious ridiculous-ness of his claim. All he is doing is throwing his own money away
It will now be moved to federal court where Slater will find that it’s not so easy to push people around….
Mr Slater has no support. Not in the media, nor the general public. Nobody has stepped forth and said, “Wait a minute, what this guy is doing is right!”.
Nobody.
Nada.
Zilch.
Zippo.
Nobody supports him because they know that what he is doing is both legally and ethically wrong.
All of his friends support him….oh wait,that’s still nobody.
Parry Sound should sue this guy for fraud for using the town’s name to extort money from people. Anyone sued by this guy should countersue for legal expenses. One might even sue him for defamation for his assertions that other people are breaking the law.
Copyright law protects writing, but it doesn’t protect, say, the title of a book. Trademark law protects branding information, but with a lot of caveats. Donald Trump’s trademark of the words “You’re Fired” might prevent another employment-based reality show from using that as a signature phrase but wouldn’t do more than that. A trademark only protects the value of the brand, i.e. the goodwill a business has accumulated for what it actually does. If there’s no business behind the trademark there are no damages to sue for. A business that is unwise enough to trademark a generic phrase is very limited in its ability to try to apply its trademark; the onus of proof is on the trademark owner to prove that someone else’s use of the phrase represents its business instead of just being a generic use.
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Firstly- I want to commence by stating that I am solely voicing my opinion and would appreciate that the person named in the above-mentioned blog is aware, because I like to give notice, and lots of it; no worries, no lawsuit ahead, that I am protected by the Charter of Rights. Carrying on, to continue: (sad that I have to cover my own ass on a blog)
What I find really amusing is that the owner of this company has made a specific remark about us focusing on another problem (HST). I guess your realizing that bad pr and and not so great response to your greed resulted in a not so good future outcome with respect to business dealings.
You may have been granted legal ownership of a Trademark, for now- but you will not get the vote when it comes down to it. If you do get the vote- better acknowledge that you may want to invest your settlement because it will probably be the last money you see given the above-mentioned outcome. a good 23K may get you going for a year , if careful.cots- up in the air- and very limited I bet.
I am wondering about this comment about HST: is it because your lawyer’s bill is swimming with the new beloved tax and that it’s fascinatingly costing you more per hour to defend your greed? It is irony that this all seems to happen at the same time. Kind of euphoric for some.
And the DOS-like get-up has go to go.. let’s work together to get that website a little vamped up with some style. You can do much better than use Paint- Try publisher programs for enhancement and ideas- it’s a handy too- they are even teaching it to the children in school. You may want to hire an grade 8 apprentice to help you out.
Slater was too cheap to hire a lawyer so he represented himself. You know what they say…”A man who represents himself has a fool for a client.”
And victory belongs to the snowmobile club!!! The lawsuit has been dropped after the courts threw Slaters preposterous claim out and Slater has declined to press forward in the federal courts.He was advised that he did not have a hope in hell of winning!